Re: Would the VP180 V4 match well with the M60 V1?
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 6,379 Likes: 7
axiomite
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axiomite
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 6,379 Likes: 7 |
I'll go do some testing. Never really thought about it before -- the VP180 is so wide it pretty much reaches both sides of my HT area anyways
M60ti, VP180, QS8, M2ti, EP500, PC-Plus 20-39 M5HP, M40ti, Sierra-1 LFR1100 active, ADA1500-4 and -8
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Re: Would the VP180 V4 match well with the M60 V1?
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 27
hobbyist
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OP
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Posts: 27 |
Craig, I don't know what your definition of a "real room" is. It's certainly NOT your ginormous man-cave...LOL! I sit exactly 8 feet away from the 150 and on centre. It sounds alright...certainly nothing like the VP160. If I sit anywhere to the left or the right, all bets are off. Mdavis, the 150 and the 180 have an unconventional tweeter location. The 160 is a D'Appolito configuration which is proven in the industry. Andrew from Axiom did a beautiful job on the 160. I'd love to hear the opinion from someone who has heard the 160 and 180 in the same environment. Honestly, just buy the 160. You'll love it. And I'll envy you . Thanks a bunch, Mojo. I hadn't realized that the 150 and 180 were using non-standard tweeter placements for centre channel speakers. Off-axis performance is important to me as well. Aesthetically, I'd have preferred a centre speaker that was less tall, but that's not the end of the world, if the performance is everything it appears to be, and certainly, the fact that it matches with the M60's is a major reason to go that route. I'm convinced! Placement-wise, it will be going in front of a large front projection screen. Because of this, I'll need to have it on the floor and not on a stand (which would put it too high). Given this, I presume I'd be best off going with the "inverted" option, that angles the components slightly upwards?
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Re: Would the VP180 V4 match well with the M60 V1?
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 27
hobbyist
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OP
hobbyist
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 27 |
I'll go do some testing. Never really thought about it before -- the VP180 is so wide it pretty much reaches both sides of my HT area anyways I have to admit, the long width of the 180 (which I presumed ensured a crazy good range for off-axis listening positions) coupled with it being lower in height were two of the reasons I was strongly leaning towards getting them.
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Re: Would the VP180 V4 match well with the M60 V1?
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 27
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The 160 is quite a bit less expensive than the 180, and is essentially an M60 in center channel format. IT's objectively the best choice to match your mains. I hadn't realized that until tonight. It definitely makes sense for me to go with the 160. Thanks a ton, everyone!
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Re: Would the VP180 V4 match well with the M60 V1?
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 27
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Amazing post, Bridgeman. Thanks! ...but I worry that it might be overkill when the fronts are M60's. Has anyone had a chance to hear how they perform in this kind of setup? I run a VP180v4 center with M60ti mains (older than your v1's) and am very happy with the combination. Guessing you're looking at 180 rather than 160 because of height ? Do they sound overpowering compared to the M60's? No risk of this -- just make sure levels are set correctly and everything will be fine. IIRC the VP180 was a couple of dB more efficient than the VP100 it replaced, but what that meant was that rather than having to boost the center channel a few dB like I did with the VP100 I could set everything to the same level and get matched SPLs. And should I be concerned about a V4 speaker not being well-matched to a system of V1's? I found the matching was very close with pink noise testing (which really exaggerates even tiny differences), and no distinguishable difference with normal content. I went from VP100 to VP180 and the difference was huge (duh ! :)). IMO it really helps having a full-range center channel even if you are crossing over at 80 Hz like me. I purchased my VP180 before the VP160 was introduced. I probably would have gone with a 180 anyways (I lean towards the view that if anything the center channel should be even more capable than the mains) but AFAICS I would have been really happy with either. For what it's worth, the VP160 is actually the center channel that I (and a bunch of other people) were bugging Axiom to produce. And they did !!
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Re: Would the VP180 V4 match well with the M60 V1?
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,422
axiomite
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axiomite
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,422 |
I have a VP180 paired up with my V2 M60s and LOVE it. Of course, I jumped on it at eh "pre-order" price and before the VP160 was announced. I have heard great things about the VP160 as well.
This, for me, was an upgrade from my original V2 VP150. Night and day difference.
I would say that if your room is moderate but not super huge, go with the VP160. Save the $$$ vs. the VP180 and be happy knowing that it is a great center speaker.
Farewell - June 4, 2020
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Re: Would the VP180 V4 match well with the M60 V1?
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Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,593 Likes: 1
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,593 Likes: 1 |
My 0.02$. I'd buy the 160.
I dont know if this is possible in your setup or not, but raising the center channel to the position your mains create their 2ch phantom image makes a huge difference in creating a seamless and realistic frount soundstage. (Tweeters aligned). This is especially true for bluray concerts. Game changing.
I'd also agree with bridgman that a center channel should be as capable if not more than the mains and carefully level matched with a measuring device. (Not just by ear.). This also helps reach that smooth seamless soundstage up front.
Most importantly, enjoy your new kick ass center channel!
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Re: Would the VP180 V4 match well with the M60 V1?
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,490 Likes: 116
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,490 Likes: 116 |
Agreed and please don't place your beautiful $900 center in a cabinet!
House of the Rising Sone Out in the mid or far field Dedicated mid-woofers are over-rated
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Re: Would the VP180 V4 match well with the M60 V1?
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,422
axiomite
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axiomite
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 5,422 |
My 0.02$. I'd buy the 160.
I dont know if this is possible in your setup or not, but raising the center channel to the position your mains create their 2ch phantom image makes a huge difference in creating a seamless and realistic frount soundstage. (Tweeters aligned). This is especially true for bluray concerts. Game changing.
My previous theater spaces had the VP150 either above or below my 104" screen, and with the right angling up or down, it sounded pretty good, but now with the VP180 beast and a 138" screen, I put it directly behind the screen. Here is a recent picture with my screen wall town down a bit. I have the M60s on small risers to get the tweeters at a better height, and the VP180 up at a height to match those tweeters. Sounds amazing. Just do the same, if at all possible, with the VP160. Here are some pictures comparing the VP180 size to the VP150. These are from back when I first go the VP180: And the VP180 next to a pair of M60s: So what I am saying here is that the VP180 is a beast! I'd still go with my last statement, and what others said, and go with the VP160 as it is a great design and should be matched super close to your older M60s.
Farewell - June 4, 2020
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Re: Would the VP180 V4 match well with the M60 V1?
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 11,458
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 11,458 |
I'll need to have it on the floor and not on a stand (which would put it too high). Given this, I presume I'd be best off going with the "inverted" option, that angles the components slightly upwards? I agree that the 160 might be your better bet, though I have not heard the 180. In either case, though, I don't think you will get the best performance by placing the speaker on the ground.
::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::
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