Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater Timber Matching SVS with Axiom

Does anyone run SVS fronts with Axiom surrounds?

I currently have all axiom speakers, but am moving to a new house and plan on starting over. The room will be 21 x 14.5. It is a family room with a fireplace at the far end and entrance to kitchen on the other. Therefore I will be viewing the Tzv\projector screen from roughly 12 feet with about 2.5 feet behind me.

I am thinking of using 4 in wall M3s for surrounds, 4 in ceiling M3s for atmos. I am not sure yet if i will go with the Axiom M60\80s or SVS ultras\ pinnacles for the front. I will decide this once i audition the fronts. However SVS does not have in wall speakers for the surroungs\atmos so i most likely will go with axiom for that. My question is whether timber matching is something i have to worry about in this type of setup if i choose SVS for the fronts?

Also any thoughts on the in wall M2s vs M3s for back and side surrounds? I know the bookshelf M3s have a somewhat unnatural bump in lower frequencies so thought i would ask.

At my place, I've heard various models of fronts with Axiom surrounds and centres. I've also heard mixtures of fronts, centers and surrounds elsewhere including Axiom mixes in those mixtures. I'm quite picky and yet I've never found different timbres to be detracting or distracting.

The M2s are more like your W22s. They have more detailed, clear mids than M3s and improved lower highs. But they don't reach as low as the M3s. If you cross them at 80Hz, they'll sound good even at high volumes.

Then again, some prefer the more mellow sound of M3s. I keep saying it would be cool for me at least to be able to switch the Axioms from M2 type sound to M3 depending on mood. That goes for my active LFRs as well.

I should also add M3 bookshelves are unnaturally bass heavy for my 1900 cu ft living room. The M2 bookshelves and on-walls are perfect in that regard.

I bought into the SVS hype and replaced my EP350 for an SVS PB2000. That was a huge mistake as I had no idea at the time the difference a decent sub makes in a room. I now have an EP600 and can't believe the difference it makes. Maybe not the best comparison you're looking for, but I learned a lesson, nonetheless. There is a good reason why SVS doesn't have an open forum on their website.

Hi listener

To answer you question, as long as the LCR speakers are matched you are ok.

The surround channels do not have to be the same brand to get great sound so long as they are properly positioned and level matched in output.

Even in a system with the same speakers all around, there will exist timber differences due to phase, acoustics and interference with your seating choice. The “head related transfer function” also plays into differences at a given angle.

Playing pink noise in each channel will quickly reveal differences, even in a matched system.

Thank you all for your input. That is great to hear. Rebulx, I was actually thinking of dual PB3000s for this new space. I have their SB1000 right now in my den and really like it. What did you not like about the PB2000? SVS always gets such great reviews... i guess i could demo those as well for comparison with Axiom. Does anyone know what the return shipping costs to return the towers and subs from the US back to axiom?

BTW the ceiling height is 12 in this room so around 3700 cu ft

In my experience the PB1000 doesn't stack up against Axiom towers.
I have the M80s in my system started with a PB1000 due to the low end of my M80s basically totally masking the PB1000 out right. I'm a proud owner of an E.P.500.

Mind you all the reviews I've seen on the 3000/4000 series have been very good. Plus they're rather large subs as well, Might help them actually produce something below 25/30 Hz.

If using Axiom towers I highly recommend one of the Axiom subs as well.

Before I went to towers SVS was sufficient {M3/M22} set ups I thought it worked great. Just not enough power for towers.

Sounds like a really nice space.

106” screen sounds about right.

I have a fair amount of experience using SVS Ultra Towers, SVS Ultra 16 sealed sub, SVS cylinder subs such as the PB2000 and the two other models up which elude me in terms of the model numbers. My experiences were very poor with all of the speakers in terms of performance and durability. Virtually all of the speakers failed in a very short term after installation.

I auditioned a pair of Bryston Middle T towers literally set next to the SVS Ultra towers and my God, it was stunning how much they bettered the SVS's in all aspects. I replaced one of the SVS subs, I think it was the 13 inch ultra cylinder sub with an Axiom EP500 and it was amazing how clean it sounded vs. the muddy mix the SVS put out. I then added in an EP800 V4 and things really ramped up in performance.

I found a pair of Bryston Model T towers which went in to replace the Middle T's... Yikes! Same sound signature, but the system elevated to a whole new level. I ultimately brought in a Bryston Model T sub which melded perfectly with the Axiom subs. Keep in mind that Bryston speakers are all built by Axiom and they share the same drivers other than the 8 inch woofers in the Bryston Model T series, but its all Axiom built equipment. Everything just works together in perfect harmony.

My advice is to skip over the SVS stuff, which I believe is all built in China and just do whatever Axiom combination you determine will work for you. The quality elevation is very evident.

I am considering using the LG ultra short throw projector and a 110 screen in this space. Just worried about day time viewing. My wife would like a tv for that reason.... I even considered a Samsung frame TV for daytime viewing and a vivid storm floor rising ALR screen to cover it in the evening.

And "Listener" since you are down in CT, if you are ever up in the southern Maine coastal area, look me up and come over for a listen.

One of the reasons i started looking into SVS is because i was never really all that happy with my EP500... i realize that might have a lot more to do with the way i set it up than the actual sub, but you're certainly giving me something to think about. I might as well at least compare my EP500 to the PB3000 in the new space before i decide to get rid of it.

Thank you for the invite. Maybe one day I will take you up on that.

My understanding is that there are some really nice screens which reject ambient light ...
Although ... they do cost some money ... a 110" screen will set you back $900 USD

Here's a write up:
https://www.projectorcentral.com/Elite-Screens-Aeon-CLR-Screen-Review.htm

The one other thing about UST projectors is that they are sensitive to small movements ... So if my sceen shakes a bit from the big explosion in the movie ... I wonder if you might see it in the picture (my walls are on resilient channel and they are designed to move a bit ... so this is a real worry of mine). One does not worry about such things with a normal projector since the delta movement is <<< then the projected distance.

Yes i did look at that and am considering either that one or the Vivid Storm ALR (Ambient Light Rejecting) floor rising screen.... though this would make the screen even more likely to move due to thunderous bass or air movement. $900 is not too bad for the screen considering the projector itself is almost 6k.... hopefully there will be a good Black Friday sale =)

Hey L,

I just added some pics to my lil review of the SVS vs 600 review. Look it over. I've learned a lot in the last few months about speakers and sound pressure levels and can say with certainty that moving things around makes a huge difference. I've also started to learn how to take measurements with REW, it's taking my little sound hobby to a new level, pretty neat. Worth checking out. Here is a pic of taking measurements.... wife saw mic and thought I was going to start singing lol

Rubulx, you have some work to do. That magnitude response plot looks like the Rocky Mountains.

BTW, do you have the SB-2000 or the PB-2000. The PB is ported. The SB is sealed.

I reached out to Ian by recommendation of a forum member. He recommended the 80s vs 60s for this space and 2 EP500s.

Hope to have some time in December to start setting things up. My wife will think i'm crazy. I will order the fronts the M80s, Ultras, and Pinnacles to test them all out in my space. After that i will order 2 EP500s and 2 PB3000s to decide which way to go with subs. The surrounds and ceiling speakers will be axiom. It's going to be a fun time. I feel like a little kid during Christmas =)

Good stuff. Are you thinking HP drivers or standard on those M80s?

Standard. Coming from w22s the 80s will be a huge upgrade. I listen at moderate levels due to my family so I think that will be enough for me.

Agreed.

You strike me as a person who is curious. You may want to order a pair of M2 bookshelves and compare against the M80 and SVS. Use a sub with the M2. You may be pleasantly surprised at just how good they soundstage and image. In my book, they are good for up to 12 foot listening distances.

Check out my M2OW and bookshelves. I love the v4 mid-woofer. I love v4...period!









Some serious bass, without a sub, from the robust mid-woofer right here:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dbcSBrC2N433hb0nkj3vYxa3Bf-vxx6Z/view?usp=drivesdk

=) that is an interesting idea. I do already have a nice pair of stands i could test them with.... i'm a little afraid of what i might find out with such a test.

As an aside i had a funny conversation with my wife today. When i told her i was planning on using in wall speakers for the surrounds she said not to over do it with the "in wall stuff" ...... she wants to see some big speakers in the room since she likes the way they look =) That's nice to hear. The current setup i have are the on wall W22\W150 in high gloss cherry. They are some nice looking speakers.

I always assumed the on-walls were garbage. I couldn't have been more wrong. The real wood veneer makes them look like art. It's also quite nice to get the speakers off the floor and open the space up.

Here's a shot of the M2OW in my living room and a close-up. They have ports on the bottom to extend the bass response.

Mojo, pay no attention to those REW results lol. I didn't realize what was on the TV! Despite my fireplace and sliding glass door I've smoothed things out quite a bit! It's a learning experience.

btw, L, I went from considering 60's to 80's and then to 100's and finally settled on 100's... Ian said they should ship out tomorrow... fingers crossed. Will be adding the Axiom 250 RMS amp the following week.

I can't wait for you to get the M100. The M100 with the 1250 will melt your brain real nice.

I hope so Mojo, me and Ian had to come up with a unique way to keep them from falling off my short back mantel, I got the tools, he's suppling the outriggers. YEE HAA!

You'll have to post photos of that.

Well the M80s have been ordered. So far i've been testing 2 projectors in my living room. The optoma P2 and the Vava. I've decided not to go for the LG to save some money. I'm shocked at how good both of these projectors are. In the end i think i will go with the Vava. I got the matte black one and i like how it disappears in the room. The white Optoma stands out too much and reflects some light during movies when the room is dark. So far i've been projecting on the wall since my screen has not come in yet.

I also have SVS ultra towers and the PB3000 here. I love the rumble of that sub and so far the speakers have been pretty impressive as well. This is a big change for me coming from the on walls. Once the M80s get here i will need to make a decision.

The in wall and in ceiling surrounds are already on their way from axiom as well.

Listener, sounds like fun. I am curious why you went with the Ultras vs. the Pinnacles.

What screen are you using and how big is it?

I'm very interested in UST projectors. Especially something which can project on to a 150" screen which Vava claims to do. The only draw back to the Vava that I've heard is that it's pretty loud. (Also worrying was that one reviewer said that customer service is hard to reach.)

My biggest worry with USTs is that the picture is very sensitive to small changes in screen distance. I'd need to test this out since the screen would be mounted on a resident channel wall. The worry being interaction between the picture and loud sounds. Lastly is that a 150" 4k ALR short throw screen could cost more than the projector.

hmmm ... my wife wants all the speakers hidden if possible ... hence the smaller M2's in the family room. Luckily, the HT is my room ... so I can do what ever I want.

I ordered a 120" PET Crystal ALR Screen from XY screens.

The vava is definately louder than the optoma, but i only notice it when not watching anything... only when i first power it on. Once anything is playing i no longer notice the sound of the projector itself.

The ultra towers are supposed to be the best they carry. That's really the reason. I also like the way they look. I have to say that even without a sub they put out a lot of bass.

Back a couple of months ago in order to shrink the footprint of my rather "busy" A/V system, I bit the bullet and replaced my VP180 V3 and my L/R M80 V2's with an OW VP180 and 2 M5 OW for my L/R set-up and now after a period of time listening, compared to the previous arrangement, in terms of sound and capabilities, I really gave up little or nothing in the process. Although I was originally looking at the larger M60 or M80OWs, considering the considerable price differential and with my set-up I didn't have the wall space anyway, the HP woofer in the M5s made up for alot of that differential in size. In any case, I took some of the money I saved and had all three OWs built in the piano glossy black, look great.

Since this set-up is used almost exclusively for video, I really can' give a comparison to the previous set-up with music, however, I am sure it would be more than adequate. I am still amazed at the technology and what still can be accomplished with sound design "without the big box". Now other than my subs and, of course, equipment racks, there are no speakers on the floor in my 9.2 system.

XY screens is a new one for me. I like the fact that they specialize in screen manufacture and are a big outfit. The $1k price tag for a 150 ALR UST screen is the least expensive I’ve seen. Wonder if some of the other more expensive screen outfits I’ve been looking at are resellers of XY?

Did you order it from alibaba.com?

Think this combo is a definite solution if I can attenuate the noisy projector (spec’ed at <32db). I have a few thoughts on that.

BIG Thanks for the info ...

Mojo,
Are you a blues harp player.
I’ve been trying to pick up it up for years now but never put enough serious time into it.
Used to play chromatic harp when I was a kid.

I blow on it and it makes screechy sounds. I guess that makes me a blues harp player.

Yes i paid on alibaba but i contacted them directly. Gloria was very helpful. She is also the one on all of their youtube videos. I ordered from them since they were the fastest. I looked at Elite Screens, but couldn't get an ETA from them on when their screen would be available.

Even though the vava is louder i really only notice it when i first power it on. It's really a non issue even though i definately notices it after playing with the optoma P2 for a week.