Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater NooB with sub question.

Hey all,

Long time lurker who doesn't currently own any Axiom products but plans to in the future. Thanks in advance for all the help that i hope you all can give me.

I need some quick advice. I have a Yamaha HTR-5550 reciever, the Fluance home theater speaker set, and a HSU STF-2 sub. My problem is i'm trying to find a way to not have to change the gain on the sub when switching back and forth between five channel stereo and DVD's.

I had the system set up using the sub output on the reciever to the LFE input on the sub, but found that i had to turn up the sub when listening to music (losing the correct surround setting) to get the right sound. I listen to country and rock and am no bass junky, but i still had to turn it up to get the right sound. The sub level was about right in plain old stereo.

Then i wired the sub inline with the mains and set them to large. The manual said to set the crossover to approximately the lowest -3 dB that the mains are rated, which on the Fluance mains is supprisingly 38Hz, so i set it there. This is great for music but when i am watching movies with lots of lower frequencies at approaching reference levels (10.5ft X 14ft room) the woofer drivers on the mains are overdriven and distort. This didn't happen when it was wired through the LFE channel. I suspect the mains which are rated for 75 watts (unspecified if that's peak or program) can handle less power at lower frequences than at higher. My reciever is rated by Yamaha at 75 watts per channel RMS.

Does anybody know how i can set up the sub where i won't have to adjust the level of the sub when switching between 5 channel stereo and surround, but keep from overpowering the drivers in the mains? Will the sub's crossover remove all the signals lower than it's setting going to the mains if i set the crossover higher when the sub is wired inline with the mains? Or am i just boned?

Thanks for the help.

Matt

Maybe I downed my 2 bourbon & cokes too quickly. I had a hard time reading that.

I'm guessing that when you drive 5 speakers for 5 channel stereo you will need to turn the sub up to account for all the increased LFE from 5 little speakers. Add more little speakers and you're going to have to add more sub.

Hi Matt, welcome!

From your description, I don't think that having your mains wired in line with the sub is going to be a good solution. I do not have the Hsu (you lucky dog), but I believe that the crossover is low-pass only. That is, the crossover on the sub is only limiting the high frequency output of the sub, not limiting the low frequency output of the mains. So, you're going to continue to overdrive the mains at certain volumes regardless of the sub crossover setting if you have them wired in line with the sub or if you have them set to large.

I'd be surprised if those Fluance speakers were *flat* down to 38Hz. Are they very large boxes?

So, we're back to having the sub on LFE and the mains set to small.

Does the receiver allow you to set the crossover frequency, or is it set at one specific point? At any rate, if the sub is running off the LFE output, set the crossover on the sub all the way out.

You should try to set up the sub (using a SPL meter if possible) so that you can leave the volume on the sub alone all the time, and just adjust the sub output on your receiver. You may have to continue to make adjustments for music/HT as you see fit, but at least you'll be able to easily quantify and return to the baseline settings on the receiver.

Of course, buying the Axiom Epic 60 Home Theatre system will solve your problem in one fell swoop.

tomtuttle,

Adjusting the LFE volume in the reciever is a great idea i never though of, thankyou. I think that will work perfectly, i'll be able to keep my gain setting while changing the relative volume to the sub.

The Fluance speakers i'm sure aren't flat down that low (fuzzy math, hehe) but are suprisingly strong. They handle Beastie Boys' "Brass Monkey" well. I've read that bass line is around 50 Hz. The Mains are excellent, the center and surrounds are crap.

That Epic 60 sounds great, although i think my next step will probably be to the Epic 80 in a few years, along with a more powerful reciever. Sweet. Can't wait.

Thank you again for the help, and you all for the friendly forum.

Matt

Matt, glad I could help. You should be able to adjust the LFE output on the receiver by 5-10 db, which hopefully will give you the flexibility you need.

I did not mean to besmirch the Fluance speakers. I apologize if it came out that way. I was concerned about you taking those measurements too literally relative to the crossover setting on the subwoofer. Like I said, you shouldn't even need to invoke the crossover on the sub if you are feeding it from the LFE output.

If you are dissatisfied with the surrounds, you might consider replacing them with the Axiom QS4 or QS8's. They are truly remarkable speakers, and would be a meaningful way for you to upgrade now while staying consistent with your future path.

Don't dismiss the Axiom speakers that are not their "top of the line"; many board regulars report great satisfaction with the M22, M3, M60 and other models. The M80 seems to require a fairly large room for best results, and can be somewhat finicky about placement. Axiom advisors have asserted that the timbre of the M60 is virtually identical to the M80, but that the M80 has greater power handling capability.

You are well-set on the sub, and would likely have a life-changing experience by changing to Axioms. Your receiver will have no trouble powering them, and needn't be replaced until you need more features or MUCH more power. As a matter of fact, I believe that Axioms are significantly more efficient than the Fluance speakers (if I am looking at the right model), so you would realize greater SPL capacity just by switching speakers and keeping your existing receiver.

So, go order up already! You won't be sorry!

At any rate, hang around the forums and give us the benefit of your experience.

In reply to:

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Maybe I downed my 2 bourbon & cokes too quickly. I had a hard time reading that.

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Hmm... if so, I should lay off the straight Pepsi too. That was a tough read!

Bren R.

"I did not mean to besmirch the Fluance speakers. I apologize if it came out that way."

nah.... They're a good deal for $250 for five speakers, but as insensitive as I am with women. hehe. You didn't come off as negative in any way. I can't wait untill i can afford even the most modest of Axiom's line. And thank you so much again for the help.

In reply to:

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I did not mean to besmirch the Fluance speakers.

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Wasn't fluance one of the Banana Splits?

Bren R.

I recently hooked up a Hsu VTF-2 Mk. II and using a Sound Meter balanced it with the rest of the system (M60's and some older Boston Acoustic bookshelfs as surrounds.) The volume level for my Rotel 1056 is normally around 60 for watching HDTV and DVD's. I have the volume on the Hsu barely cranked on with one port plugged and set to Bass Extension. It seems balanced (I set the speaker outputs with a 70db tone all around). My question is that relative to anyone's experience is this low volume setting typical? I mean we are talking 250 watts vs. the 75 per channel of the Rotel. The sub sits about a foot from a side wall and a foot from the builtin cabinets in the front. The room is 30x18, with 1/2 used for HT and viewing distance of about 12 feet.

I turn my sub up a scoach when watching movies, and back down when listening to music. I found that if I turn it up too much for movie watching the center channel gets muddied up. Try running it a little louder and you'll probably hear the same effect.

Sounds like the HSU is plenty of sub (maybe overkill?) for your room. No big deal though - have you ever heard any guy complain about having too much power in anything (cars, boats, motorcycles,, etc...)?