Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners Surrender to the M60 Posse?

The '22s are on my main system. Haven't played them through the tubes. My dad (with my "help") built the tube amps from a kit in 1975 when I was 7. They push a whopping 7 watts each. They are hooked on 1 side to an Onkyo preamp from around the same time (PA-100? the badge on back is faded almost completely) and on the other end to an even older pair of ADS Speaker Labs (no model number I can find) speakers. The speakers have an 8-inch woofer and a horn each. When I pulled the fuses for the woofers I found that the horns handle the high-mids and highs and the woofer handle the rest. The setup really sounds great. BUT it, well, it's a colored sound. I really notice this now in comparison to the Denon/Axiom setup. The tubes are warmer, mellower while the other setup is just plain more detailed and transparent. And to be honest, I can't tell you which I like better. I've only had the tube setup for 5 months, since my Dad died. But I listened to that thing from when I was 7 until I went off to college. Before the new system, I had an H/K Pro Logic setup that I mostly used for music listening. I bought it along with a "Home Theater" series RCA vcr in 1994-ish. I never was all that impressed with the
quality of the surround experience with the original Pro-Lo, hence my late arrival on the 5.1 scene. But I am now (obviously) a convert.

Considering our alleged M50 posse contains 3 members so far... I think we're a little outnumbered. I'm sure MD55 will join us, but too many have gone to the dark side (or worse...). Neverhappy, SutterCane...

I'm toying with the idea of joining you. I started doing some A/B testing between my M2s and Paradigm Atoms (aka the bedroom system). Still seems to me that the Axioms are way more accurate (pianos sound like pianos, string bass sounds like a string bass, and you can actually hear the little dangly things on the snare drums (are they called "snares" ?) doing their thing) there's something really "pleasing" about the Paradigms.

I don't think the P's are "better" as much as "maybe they have the same frequency response quirks as the speakers used to mix some of the albums" but there's something going on there. On the best recordings it's a no-brainer -- the M2s walk all over the Atoms -- but on the so-so recordings I would probably give the nod to the Atoms.

Seems to me that if it were possible to split the difference between the accuracy of the M2/M22/M60s and the "pleasantness" of the Paradigms & similar sounding speakers you would have something mighty fine. Starting to wonder if that's what the M3/M40/M50 family delivers -- great sound on a wider range of recordings without giving up too much on the best recordings.

Anyways, I'm going to experiment some more before doing anything drastic but it's something to think about.

I may be wrong, but it could be the force is with us. Mark today as an important date; The true word may start being heard. (or maybe not) At any rate, maybe by keeping interest up in the pleasant class of speakers, perhaos we won't be orphans quite so soon. But Yes, the list of departees is somewhat disheartning.

Rich

Alright! Welcome Mr. B, even if it is only conditional at the moment, it's very encouraging to find others interested in furthuring our cause, or at least expressing interest. I can't help but think that there lots of folks out there who want a speaker that is neither warm nor cold, foreward or laid back (ours isn't laid-back, rather "relaxed or "eastgoing" is more accurate) I could go on. Anyway, we hope...

Welcome to the cause.

Rich

(bridgman...Starting to wonder if that's what the M3/M40/M50 family delivers -- great sound on a wider range of recordings without giving up too much on the best recordings.)

Ya Ya that's it

Yup, I think that's it! Well said.

I think it's what was understood on the Axiom forums a few years ago but was somehow forgotten. Maybe we can just remind all those who read these posts of what were once very significant members of the Axiom family.

They deserve better than the coverage they've gotten of late.

Rich

Hi, BlueStater:
The M50 M60 question is cool, but what you have going with your fathers' tube set is actually more fasinating. I grew up with tubes in the 50s and 60s and to this day have a warm spot for them. (6.3V heaters made all the tubes hot, of course) But yes, you're correct, they do have a warm, even comfortable sound to them. I've looked at a few tube amps in the last few years, but just haven't taken the plunge yet. However, you have one with a history that you can relate to and that makes it all the more special.

There have been a number of reviews of tube sets on the Soundstage network, for example, that use the Axiom M3 as a reference monitor and they are thought of very highly. The're not terribly expensive but they sound great and they have no problem at all handling 7 watts and below. There are others on this forum that use M3s with tubes also and have voiced their enthusiasm for the match-up. Your amp with M3s in a stereo only configuration could be a real winner, reguardless of what you end up doing with your home theater set-up. At any rate your tube amp with the Onkyo preamp sounds too good to just set aside, I'm glad to hear you're using it. That kind of history deserves to be preserved.

Your Dad would be pleased.

Rich

In reply to:

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We'll get bigjohn to swear you in

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i think its a bad idea to put me in any position of officialness..?

but, hell yea.. get some 60's. wait, what was the question?

bigjohn

Yeah, it's a neat little setup. Maybe someday I'll pick up a pair of M3's. I still have to go through the box of tubes and other parts Dad had in his office. Hopefully there is some sort of manual in there for the amps. I will need to learn about biasing, etc. At least I think I will. I believe most tubes need to be biased when installed. From the look of the tube boxes, they are as old as the amps. I think he said once he bought the spares from an electronics shop that was closing down. I do remember that my old tube bass amp (Mesa Boogie Bass 400) had like 8 6550 output stage tubes and a few 7ax7 (?) preamp stage tubes. When I got the tubes changed, the bill had "biasing" as a line item. Now I'm sure the output tubes on these aren't anything near a 6550 or even a 6L6 or EL34 (common tubes in guitar amps) but I haven't really looked yet. Just been listening. Hope the spares last a good long time, though. They are Sylvanias, and from past experience with the bass amp I know quality tubes are getting hard to come by. The replacement tubes for my bass amp were "matched" Sovtek tubes. The local amp wizard (every reasonable-sized town has one of these guys who lives on the edge of town in a little house on a bunch of land and seem to know everything there is about every amplifier ever made) said the Sovteks are good tubes but you have to go through them individually to sort out the bad ones then match sets together before installing them. This is due to the legendarily bad QA in Soviet-era factories.