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I'm curious, DrunkenWolf, how would you characterize the difference? And John, I understand your logic, but to extend it a little, why even then purchase a mid-level Yamaha, Denon, Pioneer, etc? Why not go with one of their lower cost models, which seem to have the same bells and whistles and similar power ratings? Should one assume there are certain elements of 'build quality', below which undesireable sonic character is noticeable? In a nutshell, "How cheap can one go?" And again, thanks to everybody - this is great info!



The yamaha has a lot of goofy DSP things built into it and when those are turned on I'd characterize the sound as 'bathroomy'. With the DSP effects turned off I found the Yamaha doesn't give the same sound in the mid to mid high range. I wouldn't say that the HK gave a better sound, but it does have a different sound and I preferred the different sound. I compare the two after having done their respect autoadjust options with the mic on the same speakers, but not a/b switched.

WRT build quality the HK has been nothing but trouble. I've gone through two refurbs so far-the third is on the way-and this is the last chance for Harman Kardon. They tend to be oversensitive to power issues when they work properly, but of the two I've had so far one 'hung' like a computer every few hours (or minutes, it seemed random and got progressively worse) often and the other turned off right after turning it on. In both cases they blamed 'shipping damage'. That said, the service for the most part has been outstanding-they are paying for all the shipping and this last run has been an overnight deal.

Feature wise I like the HK better too-but I don't like the DSP crap the Yamaha has. Some people probably love that stuff. The HK has per input upconversion (so I can upconvert my nintendo and NOT upconvert my XBOX) for component out, the yamaha doesn't. Not sure if post 2500 models have that option. But the Yamaha works. Working is a feature that trumps anything else. The Yamaha also has their connectors properly spaced for bananaplugs. The HK supports banana plugs, but the conectors are too far apart. The HK, however, is easy to setup without using the OSD. The Yamaha can't be setup without the OSD as far as I can tell.

The fact is that AV Receivers are DESIGNED to alter the sound. They won't all sound the same. You might not find that a 22000 dollar configuration sounds better to you than a 220 configuration, but I bet you could tell that they were different.

Also, if you are going from a super separates system to thinking 'how low can I go' then it might be time to look into other things that shape sound. Like the room.

Last edited by DrunkenWolf; 10/29/06 01:10 AM.